#135 Transformative Cultural Abroad Experiences for Teen Personal Growth with Johnny Tock Transcript

THIS IS AN AUTOMATED TRANSCRIPT… PLEASE FORGIVE THE TYPOS & GRAMMAR! xo-Lisa.

Lisa Marker Robbins 00:44

In today’s episode, we’re talking about how teens and young adults can mature and grow their skills through cultural immersion. I’m excited to be joined by Johnny tuck a licensed professional counselor with over 15 years of experience working within various therapeutic environments for teens and young adults. We’ll discuss the struggles many students face, such as a lack of independence and executive function skills, and how immersive cultural experiences can provide a transformative burst the bubble effect. Dani also highlights the power of travel and cultural immersion and fostering personal growth and creating globally empathetic leaders. If you’re looking for ways to help your team find clarity and direction. This episode is packed with valuable insights and practical advice. You’ll also learn how Johnny’s programs span abroad support 16 to 23 year olds, offering high school completion gap your experiences and opportunities for those looking to pivot from an unsatisfying college path. I’m Lisa marker Robbins and I want to welcome you to College and Career Clarity it flourish coaching production. Let’s dive right in to a great conversation.

Lisa Marker Robbins 02:02

Johnny Todd, welcome to the show.

Johnny Tock 02:05

Very glad to be here. Lisa, thanks for having me. coming

Lisa Marker Robbins 02:08

at us from Spain, I always talk about i i go through so many timezones in a single day. And this is just one more instance of those. So we’re here to talk about you’re in Spain, because honestly, you help really American kids primarily, but anybody’s welcome, with a study abroad for 16 to 23 year olds over in Spain, trying to help kids who are struggling, and we know there’s a lot of kids that are struggling these days. So let’s, let’s start there, like what are we like the kids that you’re trying to help? How are you seeing them? Or other, you know, other teens? Because you’re a licensed counselor? By trade? Right? Yeah, what are the struggles?

Johnny Tock 03:01

So you know, I think and there’s so many statistics about the decline in mental health, right, especially amongst our young folks. And so that’s, that’s been a steady progression, you know, you see a lack of independence, a lack of executive functioning skills, a lack of readiness to take on their futures, and even a lack of understanding of what the heck they want to do, when it comes to planning their, their next steps. So we really are trying to look at okay, what are some things that you are struggling with? What are some things that we can target and ways that we can look at, you know, your, your current thought patterns, your current behaviors, and try to adjust those to create some really healthy habits, as well as creating a defiant some really cool future paths that are in line with people’s passions and interests. So often, people are on track for a future that they really don’t want, or really don’t understand. And, I think an integral piece and I think it’s something that you do to Lisa, which is what I really appreciate about your mission and what your what you’re doing for young folks is really allowing them to figure out what are your goals? Where did those goals come from? You know, did they come from family? Did they come from friends? Did they come from, you know, your culture or religion or whatever it might be? And then really looking at, okay, who are you as a person and do those things match up? Sometimes they do, and sometimes they don’t. But ultimately, our students are not going to gain a certain level of success, unless their future paths are in line with things that they actually are good at and actually enjoy. and see a future with. And so trying to break those things down so you can match those things up, creates a massive, a massive switch for our young folks while they’re here, when

Lisa Marker Robbins 05:13

I have a question. So you said a lot of these kids or that you’re working with are on a path that they don’t even want? Who’s put them on those? Do you feel like it’s parental societal? Teachers?

Johnny Tock 05:27

I think it’s all the above, you know, I think, you know, a certain students get pressure from friend groups, certain students get pressure from, you know, family, they get pressure from absolutely society, this idea of, you know, for many of them, okay, I finished high school, my next step is college, even though I don’t know what I want to study.

Lisa Marker Robbins 05:51

From over here,

Johnny Tock 05:53

or, you know, I grew up in a family of doctors, and so my expectation is that I’m going to go to medical school, when in all actuality, like, that’s not my wheelhouse. I’m an artist, you know, or, or, you know, I enjoy science or different types of science. And so, so really trying to add, like, look at that and give them permission to do that. I think a lot of our young folks don’t know that that’s okay, to actually take some time to figure those things out. Whether or not they feel like, own No, I’m gonna be a 19 year old as a freshman, or, you know, I won’t graduate high school, or I won’t graduate college until I’m 20, you know, three or four, where, you know, this idea of life being a marathon, not a sprint, and trying to take some time to figure out what your next pass should be, instead of what they are,

Lisa Marker Robbins 06:53

that’s hard for them to the marathon part, like, you know, their, their life is so short at that point, where, you know, here I sit 55, and my kids are all raised. And I’m like, yes, it’s a marathon, right? Yeah. And so when you talk about, like, the struggles, let’s go back to that. So a, like kind of being on a path that maybe is being imposed by others, or they just haven’t really kind of paused to give it the time and intention. But I know, you know, when I was reading your bio, and about your program, you also talk about, like, addictions that our teens and young adults are facing, and like really some practical things that you as a therapist are super knowledgeable about, like, what are some of those to like, if a parent because sometimes as a parent, and I remember this when my kids were teenagers, and I even say now people are like, Oh, how are your kids doing? Well, I think, okay, like, there’s a lot we don’t know, in the lives of teenagers, as a parent. So like, if if our listeners are primarily parents, or adults that are working with teens, and they might be thinking, Oh, my kids, okay, what would be some areas where their kid maybe isn’t okay, and they’re struggling? And I’m not saying every kid struggling, not all of my kids have struggled, and some of them have. So what do we look for?

Johnny Tock 08:15

Yeah, so I think the stroke can look differently for different different kids. And I think that’s something that we always need to celebrate and recognize is every single student’s individuality, and everybody’s struggle is unique to them. And so you need to honor that and respect that. I see a lot of students. When I get calls, I hear so many families and parents and students say, things were going, you know, okay, or good, and then COVID hit. And so that seems to be something whether that whether or not that can be the sole focus, right. I think sometimes it’s easy to say this is the one reason but you know, I think during those years that were formidable for a lot of our young folks, I seem to I liked the terminology or the image of of our young people living in a bubble, right? It was, you know, for our own safety, or whether it was through technology use right or, or you know, our social bubbles or whatever it might be, and how that bubble has prevented us from living life the way that they probably need to to promote healthy development and promote healthy and independent skills. So know when we look at culturally immersive programs, and I’m not just speaking about mine, I think just travel and culturally immersive programs in general. I view that as trying to burst the bubble that our students are living in, right. And I truly feel and I feel this from the bottom of my heart that exposing our young folks, especially the Those who don’t have a lot of world experience, exposing them to art, history, music, food, community, language, all of those things, is medicine for the soul. And I truly, truly feel that way. And there are all sorts of findings and stats and research connected to the benefit of an abroad experience, whether it’s academic success, mental health, the development of skills, employability, all of those types of things. So

Lisa Marker Robbins 10:37

soy, and I want our listeners to know because I already know this about you. We met earlier this year. And we’ve talked enough that so as a licensed counselor, you know, you’re an American, grew up in the Midwest, moved to the Pacific Northwest, you could have stayed in the States, and continued to work with kids who are struggling. But this but you move your family and your entire operation abroad, specifically to Spain, there’s a lot of I love the intentionality with which your family is living your life that you’ve created your business, because I’m very much about intentionality, alignment with our values and who we are. I’m going at it from a career perspective coaching perspective, obviously, on what comes next for our kiddos. But this idea of bringing a kid to another culture was really intentional on your part, like, how does that accomplish? Like, can we accomplish it in the US? Can we not like, let’s kind of talk about that? Sure.

Johnny Tock 11:49

Yeah, I think for us with COVID, I think we took that as an opportunity to kind of detox ourselves off of some of our own personal practices, or were things that we felt were important in the states that, you know, turns out weren’t that important. The mall ended up not being that important to us. And so really looking at, okay, there are certain pieces that we can let go of right. And, and looking forward to this idea I’ve had so many of my friends reached out to me, that are like, I just want to walk down a flower line street and have a cup of coffee at a cafe, and not have to worry about all the stuff that’s happening around me. One thing that I think happened that I didn’t really know was going to be such a big deal. And it it on both sides, right? There’s there’s turmoil happening in the States, whatever your beliefs might be, you’re experiencing anxiety, you’re experiencing something. And so allowing, travel to be a break from that experience. So that you can because it’s hard to figure out who you are when you’re in a pressure cooker. Or when you don’t feel like you are you know, when there’s a lack of safety happening. And so kind of giving them a little bit of this respite for them to, to kind of hone in on some of those things and figure those things out to the point where I have now had to do like a significant amount of prep work for my students returning back to the States, I never knew I was going to have to do was, you know, our students experiencing a certain level of safety, a certain level of tranquility and a certain level of peace, while there’s all this stuff happening back in the US while they’re here.

Lisa Marker Robbins 13:45

So that’s interesting. So I’m hearing two things, and I want to be corrected, if I’m wrong. This is far from my area of expertise. So what I hear there is getting away, there is an idea of there’s huge benefits from experiencing another culture, whether it’s Spain or somewhere else you intentionally chose Spain we were talking beforehand about it’s just a fantastic, very community driven lifestyle, built more around the family and community and a little bit more relaxed. There would be other places people who go to a different cultural experience, but this idea of there are benefits of getting a different cultural experience. And there’s benefits of just getting a break. Yeah, absolutely. So you went at it with the intention of just like, help giving the break and giving them the experience and now unexpectedly. So do things start to come up for these teens and young adults and we should say we’re talking about like 16 to 23 year olds in your program. So as they’re nearing Oh, it’s time to go home.

Johnny Tock 14:59

Hmm,

Lisa Marker Robbins 15:00

what’s starting to come up for them? Well, you

Johnny Tock 15:03

know, I think not just things that come up, I mean, I definitely have dealt with the safety piece, like feeling like you can walk through the streets and feeling safe. And knowing like, there’s a certain sadness around knowing that that’s not reality for them. And, you know, this person in particular was a a woman of color. And so that really struck her as like, this is something new to me. And some, you know, I know is not going to carry with me when I go back. I had, you know, again, you know, different beliefs. People are welcome to and experiencing terminal all over the place. This particular student was very liberal, but also she lived in North Carolina. And that was when the, the Roe v Wade decision took place while she was with us. And so that was a really difficult thing for her to go back to a situation where certain rights were there before she left, and certain rights were gone when she’s going to arrive.

Lisa Marker Robbins 16:04

So there’s, yeah, it really goes back to the individual values, right? Yeah. You know, I mean, I sit here in suburban Cincinnati, and it’s not dangerous to walk down the streets where I live, but there’s a different type of pressure that kids are coming back to and in our communities in the area that I live, like, it’s just even the academic pressure or just being on the path, like we were talking about earlier, like your expect your next step after high school is you should go to college. And it’s like, well, not everybody should go to college. Yeah. And so it’s all over the place. Go ahead.

Johnny Tock 16:36

No, absolutely. And I think what’s really important is, what that experience and that journey looks like, I was literally talking to a student two days ago, who was struggling with his anxiety. And, you know, I checked in with him, and I’m like, What’s going on how you doing? And he said, I’m really struggling with my anxiety. I’m starting to really evaluate some things what I want to do with my life and, and it was like, reassuring him, that’s okay. You know, that is going to cause some anxiety, you’re blown up your world, potentially, in terms of, of what you want to do next, and trying to create something that that is more in line, and maybe your decision isn’t going to sit well with with your friends or others or whatever. Like maybe you’ve created this narrative that you’re so connected to, that, you know, people might might be shocked to hear you pivot to something that that you’re gonna enjoy. And so it doesn’t always have to be college, either. I mean, I’ve had I’ve had students who are underwater welding school,

Lisa Marker Robbins 17:47

which is actually is in so demand. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, people might think we’re joking about that career. We’re not joking about it. It’s in demand high paying, because there’s no way it’s needed. Yeah.

Johnny Tock 18:02

And and being a woman as an underwater welder,

Lisa Marker Robbins 18:06

was that what it was? Yes, yeah, she

Johnny Tock 18:09

was, this is gonna be hard for me. But, you know, I had a student who came here trying to decide between two colleges, you know, one in South Carolina, and one in Colorado, and she was really struggling with its decision of which one to go to. And she left saying, I’m not going to go to either one. She’s currently finishing school up in Greece. And so like, expanding on your options, like there’s so many more options out there for you to really delve into and look at, which is exciting, which is so fun. To help them along that journey. Well,

Lisa Marker Robbins 18:44

I think, too, as I as I coach people, because the format that I work with, which is like building self awareness, which includes like everybody, every student takes the Berkman with us. But as you know, you’re hardwired personality along with your values and your aptitudes, right. So all of that is being very self aware. And then researching and knowing what careers align with that. And then choosing your path, like how you’re going to get educated do that. Well, that that builds self awareness, build career awareness, make connections, pick a path, like, I want to say to kids, and this goes back to our sprint versus the marathon. The kids might feel like this is a sprint, being older, we know that it’s a marathon, but what I use that framework with anyone from 15 to retirement in I’m going to be meeting with a gentleman later this month who is in his early 60s And he’s selling his company and he’s like I’m not finished yet but I want to make sure the path that I go down and he goes I don’t need money, but it aligns with what lights me up right but the reality is the the lane is very wide people can’t see my hands right now but I’ve got my hands very wide the lane It’s very wide when you are 1516 1822. But the longer we go in life, it does narrow, where like, I see people say, Well, I don’t I have a family now, or now I can’t afford to go get that educate like if they’re 30 or 40, and then got on the right path. So there’s no time like this 16 to 23 year old timeframe I used to have,

Johnny Tock 20:25

yeah, so I used to work with young folks all the time in a clinical sense. And I would, I would often have them draw, I would often have them draw 600 dots on a piece of paper out. And I would then have them circle two of those dots of the 600. And I’d say, Okay, this is our time that we’re going to work together, there’s these two dots. Now, are you willing to give me these two dots, in order to change the trajectory of all the rest of the dots on this huge piece of paper, I’m a very visual person. And I think that exercise is powerful for our young folks to help put them in perspective, in terms of, you know, you do the work now, your future can be different. I’m a big believer in this idea of severance. So, you know, allowing important life experiences to create change. And so creating something special for our young folks, that allows them to say, okay, these are things that I used to do and things that ways I used to think and, and now, this is gonna be my moment of change, where I’m going to do things a little bit differently. And, you know, it can happen in a conversation, it can happen, you know, after seeing something on online, but historically, the most impactful experience you create, the more likely you can create that monumental shift and change. So that

Lisa Marker Robbins 22:06

really kind of goes back to it’s, it’s a bigger shift to, like, go abroad and do this while certainly and there’s gonna be listeners are like, Well, my, I can’t afford to pay for my kid to go to Spain and Johnny’s program or whatever. And we’ll have those listeners and will have listeners are like, Oh, that’s, that’s a cool opportunity. I got to check this out, or something like that even. But you can take you can create those breaks, right to facilitate that change. And that severance, I like what you said there locally, but yes, it is going to be more impactful if you really get out right?

Johnny Tock 22:46

Yeah, no, absolutely. And really, what needs to happen is, you know, create that severance, absolutely. But you also need to work on skills and tools that are going to be transferable back to whatever situation is going back to right. So this isn’t just a vacation. Yeah.

Lisa Marker Robbins 23:05

Let’s talk about that. Like what do you. So let’s talk when I want to say one quick thing. And I want to talk about like those? What what you’re doing when you do this, right. So you were talking about how like that severance idea. I was talking to one of my executive coaching clients, I also work with business owners who are adults, on a lot of the transformational stuff as well. And this one guy has gone through a lot of transformation through the work that we’ve been doing. And he said something about like, well, it’s a new chapter, right? He’s in a new position, he’s doing something new. And I said, Actually, I’m gonna argue that you’re writing a new book, right? And we talk often about this metaphor of like, oh, the, I’m on to the next chapter, or I just closed a chapter, a chapter in a book would kind of indicate that you’re a similar character. And sometimes that transformation is so great that I will say to my clients, teens, young adults, adults, know you really have dug in and done this intentional work. I’m going to steal your dot exercise, by the way, but and, and I will say it’s yours. But you those two dots were so meaningful, that you’re actually an entire different character in a different story. And you can be like, that’s

Johnny Tock 24:25

possible. Yeah, that’s wonderful. Absolutely.

Lisa Marker Robbins 24:28

It’s not a new chapter, my friends. It’s a new book. So let’s talk about I have a lot of curiosity around you say 16 to 23 year olds, so that obviously includes high schoolers. Those that have graduated from high school I’m curious about like, are those gap years are those kids that are in college and just taking a break? How in the world does something like this work for a high school student who has requirements they need to meet to graduate but yet, they might really benefit from bursting that bubble and getting out and doing something new?

Johnny Tock 25:05

Yeah, absolutely. So you know, we target two groups, where we have our 1618 year old students that are still in high school, and then 17 to 23, who have graduated from high school. So those are the two separations. But what’s really cool about the 16, to 18, the high school range is this idea of being able to do online high school in a different location in a different country. So almost creating, you know, young, academic digital nomads, for our students, where, you know, if you’re doing online studying, why not do it in Spain, do it, do it with this supportive coaching, where you can, you know, be in Spain, get a high school education, and really figure out yourself and next steps. So it’s a really cool combination of all of those things, that that is going to be wonderful for our young folks. And then, you know, our other program that after high school, we do get a lot of students who are taking a traditional gap year. And that’s all right. You know, I think more and more people are recommending this, students do that. So that they can take some more time to figure out who they are and what they want. And then obviously, we get students then tried to do something that might not have been in line with who they are, or maybe, you know, they experienced college a certain way, and it didn’t work for them, or there were some skills that they needed to really improve on. And maybe they want to go back, or maybe they want to do something different, different. So you know, that’s all part of that process and figuring out what are those next steps that you want to do. And I really did try to create a program that I really would have benefited from, you know, as, as a young person, the idea of going through life and experiencing certain things, but also having, you know, a coach there to help me figure it out. So I wasn’t trying to do it on my own. And that could have been academic that could have been with relationships that could have been with my career, all of those things. So having the support of a coach to guide me along the way, and the environment have a culturally immersive experience to help me figure out who I am.

Lisa Marker Robbins 27:32

I love that, you know, as a brain, this in the home plate, it’s some of the things I think about, like, I love that this is possible for high schoolers, like what what a great world that we live in, that you don’t have to wait until, in the traditional gap years are amazing, by the way, and we’ve had I’ll link to we have two previous episodes on gap years, and how to creatively think about them and what your options are and what you want to get out of them. Because gap years, if you’re college bound should not be a vacation. Filled with purpose, I would just guess that we probably agree with that on that point. So we’ll link to those two previous episodes in the show notes. But the fact that you don’t have to wait, this could work for a high school student, I love that. And it might feel really big right now for a listener to think like, Oh, I’m gonna send my high schooler to Spain. Is it for a semester or for a year? For a year? You

Johnny Tock 28:31

both? Yeah,

Lisa Marker Robbins 28:32

you’ve got both options. But I think what I’m walking away with is like, let’s break that burst that bubble and tear that bubble, do a tear in the bubble, and do something to start to break out to facilitate growth, right?

Johnny Tock 28:51

Yeah, absolutely. I think for a lot of times, like, our families, our parents, we know our kids, we know their struggles, we we have our concerns and worries. And then we send them off to college, knowing that they might not have the skills and tools to be successful. And so, you know, when we do that, you know, are we we’ve got to be honest with with our, our kids and our ourselves. And, you know, we really, we want to always set people up for success. And you know, if there is a way that we can really hone in on some of those skills and improve those pieces. I think it’s a really good good thing to do. It’s a great opportunity for young folks and again, gap years in general not just speaking about my own so. So yeah, it’s it’s a great opportunity for growth. Yeah,

Lisa Marker Robbins 29:45

we’ve talked on previous episodes about being college capable, so academically, I can do the work. Yeah, and college ready, which are really two different things. There’s a lot of smart kids who academically could go to college, they’re capable of being academically successful. And yet, they may not have the executive functioning skills, or they might not be emotionally or socially ready, so that they’re college ready. Two different things, my

Johnny Tock 30:12

friends. Yeah, Yep, absolutely.

Lisa Marker Robbins 30:15

Well, Johnny, it’s been a pleasure. I know we will see you again, because it’s been a great conversation. And thank you for making time.

Johnny Tock 30:24

Thank you so much for having me, Lisa. This has been wonderful. So really, really appreciate it.

Lisa Marker Robbins 30:28

And where can people find you if they want to get more information on your program? Sure. Visit

Johnny Tock 30:33

our website. We’re Spain abroad. So Spain abroad.com is our website or feel free to email me at Johnny at Spain abroad? Spin abroad.com Sorry. Awesome.

Lisa Marker Robbins 30:45

Thanks, Johnny.

Johnny Tock 30:46

All right, perfect.

Lisa Marker Robbins 30:53

Thank you to Johnny tuck for sharing his incredible insights into the power of cultural immersion and personal growth for teens. As we wrap up, I encourage you to do the 600 Dots exercise generally describe, I have a twist on it. The average life expectancy of a 17 year old is another 720 months, give or take a few I had chat GPT make a grid of 720 dots to represent each of these months. You can download my PDF at flourish coaching co.com forward slash dots to make this exercise easier for you. Then ask your teen to circle one dot have them physically do this. Then explain if they only spend one hour a week from the middle of 10th grade to October of 12th grade when submitting college applications. This is approximately 88 hours. Some will spend more others less, but the point is they only need to devote less than one.to intentionally doing the college bound journey, which will have a positive ripple effect for the next 719 dots they will live. This activity will help your team visualize the impact of focused intention and how making intentional decisions now can shape their future. Thank you to Johnny for letting me borrow his idea and putting a twist on it. If you’re a faithful listener, will you please do me a favor and take just a minute to rate and review the podcast that helps me make a ripple effect into positively impacting other families and put teens on a path to being motivated, clear and confident about their future. Okay, friends, see you next week.